Pits Of Nottinghamshire.

[John]

Babbington. The first deep mine in the "concealed" coalfield.
Bestwood.
Calverton.

Clifton. 265 yards deep, sunk in 1868, seams worked, Deep Soft, Deep Hard, Piper and Tupton. (Low Main seam) Other seams known, Top Hard at 70 yards from the surface but unworkable due to being in water bearing strata, seam thickness approx 6 feet.
50 yards south of the shafts was a major fault with a 95 yard throw downwards.
There were 15 seams considered to be unworkable.
Because of the fault and all coal being worked out around the north, west and east workings, two drifts were sunk from pit bottom to the deep hard seam on the other side of the fault, all workings then were to the south. The drifts were called Stone Head and South Main Returns.

Cotgrave.
Started working the deep soft seam to the north, but had geological problems due to a soft floor and roof. Roadways converged, eventually during the mid sixties the seam was abandoned. Deep hard became the next seam to be worked to the south, east and west of the colliery. Last seam to be accessed was the Parkgate seam, below the Tupton, (Low Main).

Gedling.
Hucknall No1
Hucknall No2.
Linby.
Radford.
Wollaton.

In the shire were..
Newstead.
Bevercotes.
Mansfield.
Harworth.
Kirkby.
Ollerton.
Bentinck.
Pye Hill.
Thoresby.
Welbeck.
Clipston.
Rufford.
Blidworth.
Annesley.
Moorgreen.
Selston.

Sutton.
Bentinck.
Bilsthorpe.
Silverhill.
Teversal.



Firbeck.
Sherwood.
Lodge.
Highpark.
Manton.
Warsop Main.
Shireoaks.
New Hucknall.
Steetley.
Langton.
Cossall.
New Selston.
Oakwood Grange.






I'll add more and dates later.

[brewtime]

Admin, first time I've ever posted on one of these forum thingies, so ignore the poor grammer, some additions to your notts pits. Sherwood, Warsop Main, New Hucknall, Langton, Cossall, Oakwood Grange, New Selston(Bull&Butcher), Lodge, High Park, Then there's Firbeck, Manton, Shireoaks and Steetley. Pinxton and pleasley are in Derbyshire

[John]

Thanks mate, how I messed the Notts pits up I don't know, being from that area myself years back.

I recall seeing Pinxton from Bentinck training centre when I was taking my final practical test way back in the 60's. You could see it and the M1 from that site.

[dazbt]

brewtime said:

Admin, first time I've ever posted on one of these forum thingies, so ignore the poor grammer, some additions to your notts pits. Sherwood, Warsop Main, New Hucknall, Langton, Cossall, Oakwood Grange, New Selston(Bull&Butcher), Lodge, High Park, Then there's Firbeck, Manton, Shireoaks and Steetley. Pinxton and pleasley are in Derbyshire

By gum a flurry of activity on here at the moment, brilliant. I'm not sure but I think that both Manton and Shireoaks were in the South Yorkshire NCB and BC Division. There were always one or two pits that geographically were in the wrong area one way or another.

[John]

dazbt said:

brewtime said:

Admin, first time I've ever posted on one of these forum thingies, so ignore the poor grammer, some additions to your notts pits. Sherwood, Warsop Main, New Hucknall, Langton, Cossall, Oakwood Grange, New Selston(Bull&Butcher), Lodge, High Park, Then there's Firbeck, Manton, Shireoaks and Steetley. Pinxton and pleasley are in Derbyshire

By gum a flurry of activity on here at the moment, brilliant. I'm not sure but I think that both Manton and Shireoaks were in the South Yorkshire NCB and BC Division. There were always one or two pits that geographically were in the wrong area one way or another.

Activity is what we need Daz, loads of members and tons of posts. There must be a wealth of information in some of the guests who visit here. That info would be helpful to all!

[brewtime]

all factories now or warehouses for chinese imports, at pinxton and bentinck, with amassive waste tip due at Bentinck Tip, only mining link is the joy service centre at pinxton

[John]

There's a pork pie factory on top of my old pit, Clifton in Nottingham, and I believe an industrial complex on the Cotgrave site.
I recall the last time I was over in the UK, we stopped at my Sisters place in Hucknall, just a little down the road from where Linby used to be. I recall with sadness shopping where Hucknall Colliery once stood.
I spent my first year at Tech at the Digby Road college.

[brewtime]

Agree that manton and shireoaks where in NCB south yorks, as miners at these pits belonged to south yorks miners union then the yorkshire num, so most likely put into yorkshire area for admin. Also Cresswell was in Derbyshire, but was in the North notts area, as miners where in the notts num, Brookhill and Pinxton where in the south notts area also notts num, Warsop main men left the notts num and joined the derbys num, the pit was later put in the north derbyhire area ncb, seems the NCB placed the pits in areas that the miners union came from. Nottinghamshire NCB for example probably didn't want the hassle of negotiating at area level with three different area unions

[brewtime]

Top pit in Notts for coaling got to be Thoresby, broke every coal producing record going, since it was sunk in the 1920s this has to be the most productive mine ever in Britain, Europe, what about the world. ;D

[John]

Linby Colliery in Pictures on Youtube!




I did my first year at Tech just around the corner from Linby.

[linbylad]

I did my first year at Tech just around the corner from Linby.[/quote]

Many thanks for posting the links, John. I knew the videos were going to be posted and have been looking out for them.

I watched with interest and I expected to feel some emotion being as I spent the first 19 years of my working life at Linby. Surprisingly, I felt none, nada, zilch, although the tapes were well done. Perhaps it is because so much time has passed since those days or perhaps I no long really care about my younger days..................Nah, course I do. I think it's because the video shows the surface workings and I only worked "on top" during the early years of my apprenticeship and it had changed so much between that time and the days the videos were made. The only surface installations I saw after I worked underground were the bath-house, lamp cabin, the maintenence office and the canteen, none of which are shown. I suspect the videos were made "undercover".

All that area is now covered in houses, none of which I can afford. I hope they don't grow vegetables in their gardens, I know what lays underneath the soil.

Linby Lad.

[John]

Last time I walked past the old Linby site was about 1992/3 when I made my last visit over to see my late parents and my Sister, who lived not more than a couple of hundred feet from the site.
It was just a leveled over demolition site back then, you'd never have known it had been a pit.

Your like me, after I'd done my underground training, I was rarely working topside.

[John]

Clifton Colliery, the take over in 1943.
From Hansard.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

HANSARD 1803–2005 → 1940s → 1943 → January 1943 → 19 January 1943 → Written Answers (Commons) → FUEL AND POWER
Clifton Colliery, Nottingham
HC Deb 19 January 1943 vol 386 cc72-3W 72W

§ Mr. Thorne

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power whether he can give details of why the Government decided to take over the Nottingham and Clifton Colliery; whether it had been badly managed; who will be the new manager; how many men were employed at the pit below and on the top; the number of tons of coal produced weekly; whether it is house coal or steam coal; what rate of pay will the men get working below ground and on the top; will they be paid weekly; and what amount of compensation was paid to the owners?

§ Major Lyons

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power what reasons made it necessary to acquire the shares of the Clifton Colliery, Nottingham, in addition to the assumption of management?

§ Major Lloyd George

In order to keep the Clifton Colliery in production and safeguard supplies essential to the city of Nottingham, certain trading losses of this company had been met from public funds since September, 1941. On 4th November, 1942, an authorised controller was appointed under Defence Regulation 55 whose duty it was to endeavour, by improvements in management and mining practice, to secure the maximum output in return for the continuing expenditure of public moneys in carrying on this undertaking. At the same time, Mr. J. T. Dixon was appointed as manager of the company. Effective control could not, however, be secured while there existed an issue of debentures (with arrears of interest) whose holders were entitled at any time to appoint a Receiver and thus render the authorised controller powerless to act. I therefore decided, with the consent of the Treasury, to make an Order under Defence Regulation 78 transferring the shares in the company to my nominees. The replies to the further detailed questions by the hon. Member for Plaistow (Mr. Thorne) are as follow:

The number of men employed is about 425 underground and about 120 on the surface. The weekly production is about 3,300 tons. The coal produced is mainly steam coal for industrial purposes. The men receive wages fixed in accordance with the Nottingham District Agreement 73W and are being paid weekly as heretofore. The amount payable to the former shareholders will, in accordance with the provisions of Defence Regulation 78, be assessed by the Treasury.

[John]

More from Hansard.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

HANSARD 1803–2005 → 1940s → 1946 → February 1946 → 12 February 1946 → Written Answers (Commons) → COAL INDUSTRY
Clifton Colliery, Nottingham
HC Deb 12 February 1946 vol 419 c66W 66W

§ Sir W. Smithers

asked the Minister of Fuel and Power what is the position at Clifton Colliery, Nottingham.

§ Mr. Shinwell

This colliery was taken over by the Government in November, 1942. Saleable output, which was 135,927 tons in 1941 and 146,144 tons in 1942, has risen to 198,618 in 1945. The output per manshift in 1945 also showed an improvement on the 1942 figures. The financial results have steadily improved. Following the Christmas holidays this colliery, in common with the rest of the industry, suffered some increase in absenteeism. I am confident that this is an incidental occurrence and that the improvement will continue.

[John]

Clifton Colliery viewed from the south of the river Trent. Probably circa 1940's.

[bulwellbrian]

I have just looked at the videos that were posted a few years ago. Linby was one of the pits I went down when I worked at the Area Laboratory (1959-1969). It was a good pit producing a lot from the High Main seam the working faces were a long way out I think to the north east. The seam was splitting with an increasing mid seam dirt band, but productivity was very high and the steam winder had to work hard to raise the production, it was skip wound.

Linby was the pit I struggled to get through the pit bottom ventilation doors, there must have been a good water gauge on the fan.

[bulwellbrian]

The reports from Hansard about Clifton are very interesting, I didn't know that Clifton was taken over before nationalisation. Were there any other collieries taken over by the Government anywhere in the UK?

[John]

Jun 27, 2011 10:49:49 GMT -5 bulwellbrian said:

The reports from Hansard about Clifton are very interesting, I didn't know that Clifton was taken over before nationalisation. Were there any other collieries taken over by the Government anywhere in the UK?

Not sure of any other pits were taken over before 47, I knew Clifton was the first colliery to come under government ownership. It went into receivership around 1942 and because coal supplies were just meeting the war effort, every ton was important. As Nottingham's electricity supplies were mostly fed by Wilford, it was imperative to keep Clifton open at all costs to keep the industry and lights on in Nottingham.

Clifton was at the forefront of technology too in the late 1800's, the Manager developed a rope haulage to haul tubs from the workings to pit bottom. Most collieries of the day had chain haulages.

Many machines were tried and tested at Clifton over the years, AB undercutters, Meco-Moore slicer loaders, trepanners, shearers.
Clifton was one of the first fully mechanised colliery in the East Midlands, it's last hand got face was in the late 1950s, 15's double unit.
It also had one of the earlier installed Cable Belts installed during pit shut down in 1955.

[dazbt]

Jun 27, 2011 12:48:21 GMT -5 John said:

Jun 27, 2011 10:49:49 GMT -5 bulwellbrian said:

The reports from Hansard about Clifton are very interesting, I didn't know that Clifton was taken over before nationalisation. Were there any other collieries taken over by the Government anywhere in the UK?

Not sure of any other pits were taken over before 47, I knew Clifton was the first colliery to come under government ownership. It went into receivership around 1942 and because coal supplies were just meeting the war effort, every ton was important. As Nottingham's electricity supplies were mostly fed by Wilford, it was imperative to keep Clifton open at all costs to keep the industry and lights on in Nottingham.

Clifton was at the forefront of technology too in the late 1800's, the Manager developed a rope haulage to haul tubs from the workings to pit bottom. Most collieries of the day had chain haulages.

Many machines were tried and tested at Clifton over the years, AB undercutters, Meco-Moore slicer loaders, trepanners, shearers.
Clifton was one of the first fully mechanised colliery in the East Midlands, it's last hand got face was in the late 1950s, 15's double unit.
It also had one of the earlier installed Cable Belts installed during pit shut down in 1955.

I think, but, because it is only a thought, I might well be wrong .......... (I'm sure someone will quickly point out the error,) ........... The Nationalisation of Coal Mines Act was actually made law in 1946, which technically meant that all coal mines became government property, or under their control prior to the 1947 Vesting Day, the government control of coal / mineral rights had been assumed even prior to that date.

[John]

Clifton was brought under government ownership in 1942 Daz, the owners went broke and couldn't afford to pay the bills. It was either take it over and inject capital into it or let it close. BUT, the power station would have had trouble finding new sources of coal. Nottingham received most of it's power from North Wilford in those days and there were vital war industries in Nottingham, small arms factory, railway repair yards, Raleigh Industries and even the giant John Player tobacco factories. Couldn't let the troops go without their smokes!! ;D

[bulwellbrian]

I don't think it was nationalised in the true meaning of that word, I think what happened was that the Government took control of the company and appointed the directors, similar to what happened with Northern Rock bank. The extracts from Hansard suggest that the price was left to be determined after the war.

[John]

Some information on Clipston Colliery.

Sunk in 1922 to exploit the Top Hard seam. 1950's shafts deepened to 920m, worked Top Hard, High Hazels, Yard and Deep Soft seams.

High Main 61cm @ 343m.
Clowne 61cm @ 443m.
Main Bright 23cm @ 459m.
High Hazels 117cm @ 520m.
Top Hard 183cm @ 583m.
Dunsil 97cm @ 598m.
Deep Soft 107cm @ 763m.
Deep Hard 36cm @ 775m.
Low Main, (Tupton)175cm @ 835m.
3/4 43cm @ 848m.
Yard 158cm @ 873m.
Blackshale 122cm @ 884m.

[John]

Welbeck Colliery.

Worked Top Hard, Deep Soft and Parkgate (Piper) seams

Top Hard 635m, shafts originally sunk to this seam in 1912.
Deep Soft 800m.
Parkgate 840m, accessed from two drifts from the Top Hard seam.

Parkgate 1.4 to 2.4m thick.
Deep soft 1.3 to 2.2m thick.

[John]

New Hucknall Colliery, (Huthwaite)

The New Hucknall Colliery Company sank two shafts in 1876, and a third was added in 1887.
The pit returned to two shafts in 1956 when No1 was capped that year.
Coal production commenced three years after sinking began.
Working the Top Hard from 1879 until exhaustion in 1905. Production from the Deep Hard began when No3 shaft was put down to the seam in 1887 and was worked until 1931 when it was abandoned.
It was worked again from 1950 to 1952, and from 1974 to 1979.
The Tupton was worked from No3 shaft via drifts from 1887 to 1951.
The 2nd Waterloo was worked from 1906 to 1946.
For a short time, the Deep soft was worked, 1942 to 1949, it was reopened again in 1975 until the pits closure, 59's being the last Deep Soft face.

The 1st Piper was worked 1924 to 1929 and again from 1945 to 1976. However, last Piper face was worked from Feb 1980 to Jan 1981.

The Yard seam was tapped into during 1979, but cross measure drifts showed the seam was badly affected by water from nearby closed collieries. However two faces were worked in an unaffected area, Y7's being the last in Dec 1980.

The pit escaped Robens big axe in 1968, when it had been losing money, closure came in Jan 1981 when adverse geological conditions made safe coaling impossible.

Miners at New Hucknall and Bentinck became the first in the country to be supplied with electric cap lamps in 1919, however New Hucknall men had to wait until April 1954 for pit head baths, canteen and medical centre.

Top Hard 144 yards.
Dunsil 166 yards.
2nd Waterloo 203 yards.
Deep Soft 318 yards.
1st Piper 372 yards.
Tupton 412 yards.
Yard 446 yards.

[John]

Was one of Hucknall No2's shafts deepened to the Blackshale horizon??

[colly0410]

Sept 5, 2015 6:01:17 GMT -5 John said:

Was one of Hucknall No2's shafts deepened to the Blackshale horizon??

Not that I'm aware of John. There were two drifts from the Deep Soft seam down to the Black Shale seam, intake at 1 in 5 & return at 1 in 6. There was a roadway between the drifts at the Tupton/Low Main horizon with air doors in it..

[John]

Sept 5, 2015 8:40:49 GMT -5 colly0410 said:

Sept 5, 2015 6:01:17 GMT -5 John said:

Was one of Hucknall No2's shafts deepened to the Blackshale horizon??

Not that I'm aware of John. There were two drifts from the Deep Soft seam down to the Black Shale seam, intake at 1 in 5 & return at 1 in 6. There was a roadway between the drifts at the Tupton/Low Main horizon with air doors in it..

Thanks for that Steve, basically what the Hucknall booklet says.

[rob52]

Silverhill Underground
Published on Jun 22, 2012
Should bring back some memories

News Broadcast re closures
Uploaded on Feb 29, 2012
54:52 -55:40, 56:10 - 57:50 News Broadcast re closures
"Pits Saved
Pits Mothballed
Pits onto Development
Pits to be closed"

Silverhill Colliery Workforce sent home
Published on Nov 20, 2016
Coal Mining - Silverhill Colliery - 1992
"The Miners at Silverhill Colliery that defied the year long Miners strike in the 1980's face redundancy as their pit faces closure due to the decline in coal demand and cheap imports. 'This week' Investigates.
First shown in 22/10/1992"

UDM…

Rob

[smshogun]

Bentinck was also part of the South Notts group and went over to training craft apprentices and doing their trade tests.

[smshogun]

Jun 27, 2011 15:06:07 GMT -5 dazbt said:

Jun 27, 2011 12:48:21 GMT -5 John said:

Not sure of any other pits were taken over before 47, I knew Clifton was the first colliery to come under government ownership. It went into receivership around 1942 and because coal supplies were just meeting the war effort, every ton was important. As Nottingham's electricity supplies were mostly fed by Wilford, it was imperative to keep Clifton open at all costs to keep the industry and lights on in Nottingham.

Clifton was at the forefront of technology too in the late 1800's, the Manager developed a rope haulage to haul tubs from the workings to pit bottom. Most collieries of the day had chain haulages.

Many machines were tried and tested at Clifton over the years, AB undercutters, Meco-Moore slicer loaders, trepanners, shearers.
Clifton was one of the first fully mechanised colliery in the East Midlands, it's last hand got face was in the late 1950s, 15's double unit.
It also had one of the earlier installed Cable Belts installed during pit shut down in 1955.

I think, but, because it is only a thought, I might well be wrong .......... (I'm sure someone will quickly point out the error,) ........... The Nationalisation of Coal Mines Act was actually made law in 1946, which technically meant that all coal mines became government property, or under their control prior to the 1947 Vesting Day, the government control of coal / mineral rights had been assumed even prior to that date.

Incorrect and correct, war production meant that they came under the control of the Government under the relevant legislation and a number remained under their control for several reasons.

1/ Coal stocks were depleted and an assessment was done of the coal and types of coal required, pits were selected to build up these stocks so the country could hold stocks of coal to supply the current demand for steam for electricity and for coking coal to supply gas, in addition we had the rebuilding and the huge export drive so a contingency was built in for the increased demand, also remember that we used town gas from coal prior to the 1970's changeover to North Sea gas.

2/ Collieries were selected on geographical location and coal types to provide these, and emerging industries with sufficient power as there was a huge need for things such as bricks, tiles, and cement to be produced on unprecedented scales and they as used coal in their production, and of course all the trains used to transport these necessary commodities and others such as steel and many other necessary items were all transported by rail in huge quantities so it was also about efficiency.

3/ Ministry of fuel and power assessed the needs of these and other industries and took over the running of a number of selected collieries after the war and they remained under their control and no assumption was made of mineral rights, it was an assumption over the MFP and their remaining control of them under wartime legislation as we had to build huge ships to move the goods in the export drive and the need to produce the ships and other large items such as large docks and cranes to load and unload the ships and to handle their cargo.

4/ Collieries were designated in an unofficial plan and divided into groups, there was the "national interest" where collieries were selected to produce and stockpile coal as opposed to the depleted coal stocks, coal produced for "necessary industries" such as electricity and gas production, coal for "required industries" such as those making bricks, tiles, cement, steel, other metals such as copper and smelting surplus aluminium for cables or pipes to rebuild the grid, "domestic supplies" for household coal for cooking and heating, and a number of other classifications; there were several other classifications.

5/ Many of these collieries were used for assessment of the industry itself, the objective was to close unprofitable exhausted pits and expand the production of other remaining pits and if necessary sink more pits and evaluate the technologies to achieve this when the future of the industry was going to be nationalisation.

Really there are no incorrect or correct answers.