Pits of Yorkshire.

[dazbt]

Cheers for that info Mick.

[cortonwood]

elsecar colliery and mitchells main colliery are missing from the list too,,both we're barnsley pits working at nationalization

[cortonwood]

pargate colliery and new stubbin colliery were not the same pits..

the parkgate colliery winding house and headgear are still up,i think they are listed buildings..they are on westfield lane

[John]

I'll have to post the list from the 1947 organizational charts I have, all the pits on vesting day.

[cortonwood]

hi john,theres also Highgate colliery,which was a drift mine near goldthorpe...
this mine actually merged with goldthorpe colliery..

You may have guessed given my forum name that i worked at cortonwood colliery,this was the yorkshire pit who's proposed closure sparked the '84-'85 strike,so if theres anything you'd like to know about cortonwood feel free to ask.

I also worked at barnburgh,maltby,frickley,and silverwood collieries under the ncb.

after that i had spells at markham main(armthorpe),kellingley and stillingfleet..

I also worked at hayroyds colliery,a small mine working pillar and stall .

my dad who was colliery overman at cortonwood went on to work for the small mines drainage department of the ncb,he did a lot of work sealing off old pits especially around the emley moor area mentioned in this thread,

[tygwyn]

Cortonwood,
To answer a question on the Welshcoalmines forum about Hayroyds,

How thick was the muck band between the 2 coals in the Whitemoor seam?

[dazbt]

Aug 26, 2012 17:42:17 GMT -5 tygwyn said:

Cortonwood,
To answer a question on the Welshcoalmines forum about Hayroyds,

How thick was the muck band between the 2 coals in the Whitemoor seam?

I think that might be the Whinmoor Seam that you're looking for tygwyn. Whinmoor was worked in many of the Barnsley pits but the nearest to Hay Royds was probably Emley Moor, 'Emleymick 44' worked there and might be able to answer at least for the Emley muckband, if it had one.

[tygwyn]

Whinmoor,thats the boy,thanks.

[Wheldale]

Aug 27, 2012 5:47:11 GMT -5 dazbt said:

Aug 26, 2012 17:42:17 GMT -5 tygwyn said:

Cortonwood,
To answer a question on the Welshcoalmines forum about Hayroyds,

How thick was the muck band between the 2 coals in the Whitemoor seam?

I think that might be the Whinmoor Seam that you're looking for tygwyn. Whinmoor was worked in many of the Barnsley pits but the nearest to Hay Royds was probably Emley Moor, 'Emleymick 44' worked there and might be able to answer at least for the Emley muckband, if it had one.

Yeah the question of thickness is doing my head in now! lol. I thought the whinmoor seam at Hayroyds had a 3 foot muck band. But I must be wrong as now thinking about it it doesnt seem right. I remember going on a visit there in 93 and 95 which is nearly 20 years ago so my memory is probably a little faded now.

So can anyone answer the question just so I can hold my hand up and say I was wrong?!

[dazbt]

Aug 27, 2012 7:44:45 GMT -5 Wheldale said:

Aug 27, 2012 5:47:11 GMT -5 dazbt said:

I think that might be the Whinmoor Seam that you're looking for tygwyn. Whinmoor was worked in many of the Barnsley pits but the nearest to Hay Royds was probably Emley Moor, 'Emleymick 44' worked there and might be able to answer at least for the Emley muckband, if it had one.

Yeah the question of thickness is doing my head in now! lol. I thought the whinmoor seam at Hayroyds had a 3 foot muck band. But I must be wrong as now thinking about it it doesnt seem right. I remember going on a visit there in 93 and 95 which is nearly 20 years ago so my memory is probably a little faded now.

So can anyone answer the question just so I can hold my hand up and say I was wrong?!

In 1995 (or thereabouts) I've found mention of Hay Royds working a 1.6m section with a middle muck band of 0.4m.

[Wheldale]

Thought I must have been mistaken. Dont know where I got a 3ft band from!

[cortonwood]

the dirt band varied.it is thicker on the rise side and as far as i'm aware is practically non existent on the dip side (where any future coal reserves are).
0.4m would be about right for the area we were working,I was there 2007-2008.
the dirt band went out in the rom and was then pumped back down the pit and into the old workings.
incidently i heard last week that hayroyds is stood down and they are trying to find a buyer,i dont know how long its been like that,but the bloke who told me picks the scrap up from there and is an ex miner so its probably true.

[Wheldale]

Aug 27, 2012 13:42:55 GMT -5 cortonwood said:

the dirt band varied.it is thicker on the rise side and as far as i'm aware is practically non existent on the dip side (where any future coal reserves are).
0.4m would be about right for the area we were working,I was there 2007-2008.
the dirt band went out in the rom and was then pumped back down the pit and into the old workings.
incidently i heard last week that hayroyds is stood down and they are trying to find a buyer,i dont know how long its been like that,but the bloke who told me picks the scrap up from there and is an ex miner so its probably true.

Its on the Welsh forum that the drifts are being sealed so it looks like the end of Hayroyds. I remember chatting to Mr Flack a few times, I dont know where I got the 3ft dirt band from? I remember they took the seam section in 3 goes.

I remember Denby grange pit had a similar section of seam with a large dirt band in it, im probably getting confused with that.

[dazbt]

Park Mill Colliery Barnsley Area, I seem to recall, worked the split Fenton seam, both the ‘Top’ and ‘Low’ separately in the 1960s, Top Fenton on the rise and Low on the dip until it was realised that the two leaves were unexpectedly coming together. At some point around the early 1970s a decision was taken to look at the possibility of working the two leaves together, the original intention was to use a double ended ranging drum shearer, cut both Top and Low sections in one pass and leave the 0.4m (approx.) middle muck-band hanging to be cut and loaded on a second pass. So confident were the ‘powers that be’ that this muck band was strong enough to stand on its own that a great deal of time and money (and no doubt a lot of political wrangling) was spent in developing a unique hybrid shearer, an AB DERDS but by means of a one off adaptor box designed to accommodate an Eickhoff ranging arm gearhead gearbox and arm (necessary because at the last minute it was realised that AB ranging arm gearheads available at that time could not accommodate the small diameter cutting drum needed.) From what I recall the plan didn’t work, the muck-band wasn’t quite as strong as some thought and fell into the trailing drum to be loaded along with the cut, or at best fell shortly after the machine passed onto the AFC. I wasn’t allowed to be involved with the installation but from what I remember the face did work fairly successfully on a three pass cutting sequence, Tops first, mucking run on a flit and Low bottoms on a third coaling flit run ……….. my memory isn’t as good as it should be but I believe that’s the gist of it ……… it would be a bit of an expensive way of resolving the Hay Royd’s situation though !!

[John]

I wonder if that's the seam seam/s we called the Piper, 1st and 2nd Daz??
It was also known as the Parkgate and could be two distinct seams, 1st and 2nd with as much as 30 plus feet between them and merged into one seam in other places.
It was a highly bituminous coal, probably close to anthracite, but still called bituminous. Very hot and low ash content, looked like it had been polished when headed out.

[dazbt]

Aug 27, 2012 16:10:09 GMT -5 John said:

I wonder if that's the seam seam/s we called the Piper, 1st and 2nd Daz??
It was also known as the Parkgate and could be two distinct seams, 1st and 2nd with as much as 30 plus feet between them and merged into one seam in other places.
It was a highly bituminous coal, probably close to anthracite, but still called bituminous. Very hot and low ash content, looked like it had been polished when headed out.

The Fenton(s) hereabouts are the seam(s) above the Parkgate but remain quite seperate, however the Parkgate did split into either two or three sections, varying section dramatically even between adjacent pits, between 2m and 1m in a matter of a mile or so.

[John]

The seams above the 1st Piper in Notts were Deep Hard and then Deep Soft, both distinct seams with a fair amount of rock between them, so I doubt it was those.
I wonder what the same seam was further south then?

[cortonwood]

was the notts deep hard the equivelent of our barnsley bed and the deep soft the equivelent of our swallow wood..?

[John]

Aug 27, 2012 16:47:42 GMT -5 cortonwood said:

was the notts deep hard the equivelent of our barnsley bed and the deep soft the equivelent of our swallow wood..?

No mate, that's better known as the Top Hard seam, most of the pits to the west of the shire, erewash valley into Derbyshire, couldn't work it as its too close to the surface or outcrops.

At my first pit it was a thick seam, deep enough to work, but too close to water bearing strata.

[bulwellbrian]

Aug 27, 2012 16:10:09 GMT -5 John said:

I wonder if that's the seam seam/s we called the Piper, 1st and 2nd Daz??
It was also known as the Parkgate and could be two distinct seams, 1st and 2nd with as much as 30 plus feet between them and merged into one seam in other places.
It was a highly bituminous coal, probably close to anthracite, but still called bituminous. Very hot and low ash content, looked like it had been polished when headed out.

Sorry John but its a long way from Anthracite which has very low volatile content-its almost pure carbon. All Nottinghamshire, Derbyshire and Yorkshire coal has high volatile matter thats why you get flames when it burns.

[tygwyn]

[quote author=bulwellbrian board

Sorry John but its a long way from Anthracite which has very low volatile content-its almost pure carbon. All Nottinghamshire, Derbyshire and Yorkshire coal has high volatile matter thats why you get flames when it burns.[/quote]


Dont forget the Smoke,lol.

[tygwyn]

Cortonwood,
Maybe you can answer a question over on the Welsh coalmines site,again,
One of the boys there went to work in Kellingley after the strike,something he said shocked most of us,that thought Kellingley was a strong NUM Pit,that it was well manned with strike breakers,and not the kind from the next counties.

[emleymick44]

Cortonwood was correct about the Whinmoor Seam dirt band. As I recall at Emley Moor when we were working the Whinmoor the dirt band was about 12/13 inches thick on average. the dirt band appeared to contain a lot of cannel and the odd bit of fools gold (Iron Pyrites).

Me my Dad, Harry Taylor and Roy Sedgwick were the 4 man team opening out the face lines using an AB15 with a 6ft jib, mounted on a very small panzer and advanced forward and into cut using two jumbo rams which were attached to two Desford mushroom chocks. The whole thing was known as a "waffler" and was cobbled together by Chris Scott, the colliery mechanical engineer. The parts were all scrap items which had been lying around other Yorkshire pits stock and scrap yards.

Apparently everyone at area thought we were crackers until we began to break and set records for a drivage with that type of set up. Bear in mind, that set up had left the industry 10/15 years or more.

We drove the face lines and salvaged/installed them.

Personally, I look back on it as a great time working at a smashing little pit!

[cortonwood]

Aug 30, 2012 18:56:35 GMT -5 tygwyn said:

Cortonwood,
Maybe you can answer a question over on the Welsh coalmines site,again,
One of the boys there went to work in Kellingley after the strike,something he said shocked most of us,that thought Kellingley was a strong NUM Pit,that it was well manned with strike breakers,and not the kind from the next counties.

hiya tygwyn,

the lad on the welsh site is correct,,kellingly had a boat load of scabs,and if i remember rightly they even turned coal there during the strike.....cant and shouldnt tar them all with the same brush but yes, its true...

[tygwyn]

Thanks Cortonwood,we were shocked to hear this,as we thought Yorkshire was solid like South Wales,that must have pissed Arthur off.

I agree,its hard to tar all with the same brush,sad times.

[Wheldale]

I believe Kellingley started to turn coal in January 85. My dad was an undermanager at the Big K in the 70's. In the village I grew up in there was a few Kellingley miners lived there, one of them went back 3 weeks before the strike ended. My dad said he was a shadow of his former self after the strike.

[Mick]

There was men that went back before the end at Wheldale Sharlston and at Prince.
When the strike was over the first day shift lost all the power in the baths at Wheldale just as the scabs worked into the lockers,after about 5 mins the lights came back on and the rest is history how do i know i was there.

[Wheldale]

Hey Mick you might be able to clear something up? I read a book (cant remember the title) saying that the General manager at Wheldale on the first day back after the strike had all the day shift together and told them they had the worst strike history of all the Yorkshire pits and that the men had better start behaving themselves. I told my dad about this book but he said he couldnt remember the incident. Was you there then? Can you remember it?

[Mick]

I can tell that if that had been said Wheldale would have been the last pit to go back after the strike.
When i first started at Wheldale it tuck me 3 week to get a full week in,i remember going home once because the bath's had run out of soap and im not kidding,
So sorry mate i dont think it was ever said at lest not there.
Mick

[Wheldale]

My dad started at Wheldale in 76 as Personnel manager. He told me of a tale about a fitter I think who played rugby league. Ive forgot his name but he might have played for Castleford. Anyways the fitter got offered a contract to play for an Australian rugby team for 6 months of the year. The fella went to my dad and requested if he could go to Australia for 6 months and that he wanted his job at Wheldale keeping open for when he returned.

The answer was no! The pit was on the verge of going on strike as the union was saying it was unfair to not let this lad go and play rugby. After some heated disscussions between my dad and the union my dad pointed out that if the lad went abroad his job would need filling by another fitter and when the lad returned from Australia the replacement fitter would have to be laid off!!

The union came to the conclusion that the rugby player would have to choose - Wheldale colliery of Australia. Not sure what he chose but a strike was averted!!

Wheldale Colliery - the sunshine pit!!