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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 19, 2014 17:24:13 GMT -5
There is a bit of a discussion on another site with regards to how good Oldham lamps were
I myself prefer to use an Oldham if i go mooching underground , because , i like to see places as the guys who dug them saw them
others go on about using LED's and other brighter forms of lighting
Someone said (right or wrong) that an Oldham battery can last as long as 9 years if treated correctly ? others said as little as 9 months
I have also seen papers saying how old batteries that have dried up can be brought back from the dead ?
Does anyone on here know the best way to treat an Oldham to get the longest possible life from it ?
Thanks
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Post by John on Jul 19, 2014 18:11:49 GMT -5
There is a bit of a discussion on another site with regards to how good Oldham lamps were I myself prefer to use an Oldham if i go mooching underground , because , i like to see places as the guys who dug them saw them others go on about using LED's and other brighter forms of lighting Someone said (right or wrong) that an Oldham battery can last as long as 9 years if treated correctly ? others said as little as 9 months I have also seen papers saying how old batteries that have dried up can be brought back from the dead ? Does anyone on here know the best way to treat an Oldham to get the longest possible life from it ? Thanks I'm Lecko on that site Andy, I used Oldhams to work with for single and double shifts underground. Best bulbs in the standard Oldham were the quartz halogens, but they had prefocussed reflectors, gave out pure white light. As for battery life, in "real life" ie working with them underground as against recreational use, max life you can expect is two years, some will last longer, many failed at one year. I did a spell as surface electrician on backshifts and part of my duties was lamproom officer, well that's what it said on my authorization LOL..... I examined a few batteries to see why they failed so early, and found looking through the smoked coloured cases the cells start disintigrating and shorting the plates out. Probably caused by heavy knocks getting in the transports and knocks in the faces. I've seen them fail at just a few months, but when blokes do double shifts, they usually take a fully charged battery down to almost exhaustion, lead acid batteries don't like that, causes sulphation of the plates, where a hard layer of lead sulphate forms on the plates, eventually hardening to a glaze and stopping the chemical action from taking place.. At Boulby we had Ceag's, almost identical to Oldhams, I never counted how many batteries I had in the four and a half years I got through there, but I had almost as much time in as the winding engines, and they were bolted to the floor. I often did 12 to 16 hours shifts, breakdowns and cover sick, hols and absenteeism, so took those batteries down to almost dead stage.. Storing a lead acid battery is probably done dry, but it's impossible to drain a cap lamp battery. Leaving one for long periods is not a recommended situation. Big mines used to keep a fair stock of batteries in the stores that went out on rotation, left on the shelf for too long, sulphation of the plates will take place, then the battery is just good for recycling. Anyone who claims to get seven hours or more out of a battery that's a few years old is either lucky or BSing....LOL I'd say a well maintained Oldham battery used for recreation will last around four years or more, but the key is maintained. trickle charged, and partially discharged every month or sooner. I've heard that pulse charging lead acid batteries prolongs their life, I've not read much into this charging method, it was never mentioned when I was at tech when we covered secondary battery principles. |
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 20, 2014 17:22:06 GMT -5
Hi John , thats a real good answer and really easy to understand lol
i bought some boxes of batteries last year from the demolition company at Daw Mill , i have been charging them and then letting them burn before recharging them since , they can burn for over 14 hours before i turn them off and recharge them , so i might be leaving them on to long ?
i rotate them by switching them onto my Oldham sets every few months
The thing is these could be some of the last Oldhams left around , unless they are still used in other countries ?
so i really need to look after them
A guy has asked me to sell him some , and i didn't want to if they were going to deteriorate within a year
I'll just have to explain to him that he needs to look after them as i have done since i bought them
thanks again John
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Post by John on Jul 20, 2014 17:38:15 GMT -5
Hi John , thats a real good answer and really easy to understand lol i bought some boxes of batteries last year from the demolition company at Daw Mill , i have been charging them and then letting them burn before recharging them since , they can burn for over 14 hours before i turn them off and recharge them , so i might be leaving them on to long ? i rotate them by switching them onto my Oldham sets every few months The thing is these could be some of the last Oldhams left around , unless they are still used in other countries ? so i really need to look after them A guy has asked me to sell him some , and i didn't want to if they were going to deteriorate within a year I'll just have to explain to him that he needs to look after them as i have done since i bought them thanks again John |
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 22, 2014 3:30:25 GMT -5
TThanks for that , how long would you estimate 50% is ? and would keeping them fully charged damage them ?
ATB
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Post by John on Jul 22, 2014 5:57:38 GMT -5
TThanks for that , how long would you estimate 50% is ? and would keeping them fully charged damage them ? ATB |
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 22, 2014 10:32:53 GMT -5
Thanks John
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Post by John on Jul 22, 2014 11:12:51 GMT -5
Here's a tip, if you can find any Nickel Iron cap lamp batteries, you have a winner. They are virtually indestructible.
Edison and Ce-ag are two I recall, three cells, stainless steel cases.
The only thing other that can damage them is physical damage. Every couple of years all you need to do is drain the old electrolyte out of them and mix a new batch from powder and distilled water, then fill them up.
The electrolyte will burn the skin, BUT, it's environmentally friendly.
They do need careful charging, you cannot charge them the same as lead acid batteries, probably the reason they lost favour in the mining industry, but they are lighter than the Oldham batteries, safer, no dangerous hydrogen gases.
The very first electric car was powered by NiFe batteries!! In fact all the first Ford cars had NiFe batteries made by Fords old buddy Thomas Edison.
A lot of the old first forklift batteries were NiFe batteries, and they are 60 plus years old and still work perfectly!!
I suspect the lead acid battery companies caused the demise of the NiFe battery, as it affected their profits, ie they last virtually for ever!
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 22, 2014 18:22:41 GMT -5
Hi John i have one of those Nife Batteries of Reddich Type NH10-A hand lamp , the battery looks a bit crusty on the outside
would that charge up do you think if i changed the electrolyte ?
next question how would i charge it ? ,would a normal battery charger do the trick and where do i get some fresh electrolyte ?
Thanks Andy
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Post by John on Jul 23, 2014 6:03:49 GMT -5
Hi John i have one of those Nife Batteries of Reddich Type NH10-A hand lamp , the battery looks a bit crusty on the outside would that charge up do you think if i changed the electrolyte ? next question how would i charge it ? ,would a normal battery charger do the trick and where do i get some fresh electrolyte ? Thanks Andy
Mixing it promotes a lot of heat, you will need a Hydrometer to check the SP, DON'T use that one on lead acid batteries afterwards !!! It will be contaminated with alkali even when washed thoroughly.
Your old battery, open the vent covers, and wash the battery out with tap water until it runs clean, leave to drain upside down, when no more water drains, give it a wash out with distilled water, then add the new electrolyte.
Charging, you'll need a power supply that has an ammeter, is adjustable, and give it about 250Ma to 500 Ma charge rate. When fully charged it should check around 1.12volts per cell if my memory is right, you can find out the exact voltage off the internet. BUT don't charge with a standard charger, you won't hurt the battery BUT you will boil it dry..LOL
Needs a controlled charge from start to finish.
Most old batteries were in SS cases, new ones are in plastic cases. If I'd had the money, I'd have bought the NiFi batteries for my solar generating plant, lighter then LA's, but would have needed more for the voltage and current needed. All new large cells are either made by the Chinese or by one Russian company now. |
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 24, 2014 2:09:10 GMT -5
Thanks for the info John , that will be another project for me to look at
ATB
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Post by John on Jul 24, 2014 7:55:15 GMT -5
Thanks for the info John , that will be another project for me to look at ATB
Many years back, Clifton Colliery have NiFe batteries for shaft signal backup, beautiful bank of them in each winding engine house, about an inch thick, by around seven inches tall by about four inches wide. SS cell interconnect straps, all in a wooden frame...No idea how old they were, but I'd bet they had been in use for many, many years.
The engines were steam driven. |
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Post by andyexplorer on Jul 29, 2014 15:28:16 GMT -5
Hi John , there's a guy on ebay at the moment selling i think Youle cap lamps with the metal battery container for £12 on a buy it now
he has quite a few because he says the one you recieve may not have the same numbers as the one in the picture
But alas no batteries
i'll get one eventually , but how would i charge it ?
ATB
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Post by John on Jul 29, 2014 16:39:47 GMT -5
Hi John , there's a guy on ebay at the moment selling i think Youle cap lamps with the metal battery container for £12 on a buy it now he has quite a few because he says the one you recieve may not have the same numbers as the one in the picture But alas no batteries i'll get one eventually , but how would i charge it ? ATB
I built a regulated power supply for a mate when I was working at Angus Place, it was to charge an Oldham caplamp he had for going night fishing with.
Basically all you need as a 12 volt output transformer, bridge rectifier, filter capacitor, "three leg" 1 amp adjustable regulator and a couple of other components... I'd hazard a guess you'll find a circuit or how to on the net or Youtube..They are fairly basic and off "the shelf" parts. |
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Post by Wheldale on Apr 17, 2019 9:17:47 GMT -5
I know its an old thread but I'm looking at getting an old nife caplamp for my collection. Theres a link here to a guy who restored his lamp electrosparkles.com/edisonLooks interesting! |
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Post by John on Apr 17, 2019 14:32:38 GMT -5
I know its an old thread but I'm looking at getting an old nife caplamp for my collection. Theres a link here to a guy who restored his lamp electrosparkles.com/edisonLooks interesting! I'll have to mess around with the link, doesn't work for me. Those batteries will last forever, as long as they haven't been allowed to get seriously rusted plates. All you will need to do is change the electrolyte every few years. They do require controlled charging, a standard charger will burn out as it's like a short circuit, very low internal resistance. I had one of those years back, and sadly I left it behind when I migrated. |
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Post by John on Apr 17, 2019 14:36:56 GMT -5
I tried to edit the link twice, and I still couldn't get it to work with this site, might be my browser. I did get in via another method though.
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