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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 12, 2012 7:29:05 GMT -5
I am a student currently studying Industrial Design. If anybody currently works or has worked in the past in the mines (either underground or open) would you mind filling out this short survey for my 4th year thesis design project www.surveymonkey.com/s/DPPB77VThank you |
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Post by John on Oct 12, 2012 10:02:28 GMT -5
I am a student currently studying Industrial Design. If anybody currently works or has worked in the past in the mines (either underground or open) would you mind filling out this short survey for my 4th year thesis design project www.surveymonkey.com/s/DPPB77VThank you I'm going to be a little critical of your questions, I mean , how can you choose safety equipment, one piece over another, ie a cap lamp and helmet are essential underground, without a caplamp how are you going to see?? As regards for feeling safe etc, you would have to stipulate a country as all countries have different rules, some have very stringent regulations like the UK and Australia, others have pitiful rules and regulations. I think everyone who has worked in coal in both the UK and Australia wouldn't go underground without a self rescuer these days, standard issue safety equipment now are safety glasses, hearing protection, a good supply of disposable dust masks, safety boots, some companies provide shin guards these days too, leather gloves, and not forgetting hard hat, cap lamp and self rescuer. I note the old lead acid cap lamp battery is on the way out in favour of the Le-ion battery with LED headpiece, a lot lighter than the lamps most of us on here wore shift after shift. Some of the others here may like to comment too. Hope that helps with some of your questions. |
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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 12, 2012 10:36:47 GMT -5
Thank you for your critique. I am aware that all the pieces of safety equipment are important parts. The idea was to gage which part the worker feels is most important to them. I wasn't suggesting what would be the one thing that you would take if you had to choose.
I'm from Canada, but I am trying to learn about mining around the world.
My focus is mainly on shoulders up protection, hence the reason for only listing the ones that I did. I do appreciate the feedback and criticism.
I was wondering though, how long do you wear a dust mask before you change it for a new one?
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Post by John on Oct 12, 2012 10:44:01 GMT -5
Thank you for your critique. I am aware that all the pieces of safety equipment are important parts. The idea was to gage which part the worker feels is most important to them. I wasn't suggesting what would be the one thing that you would take if you had to choose. I'm from Canada, but I am trying to learn about mining around the world. My focus is mainly on shoulders up protection, hence the reason for only listing the ones that I did. I do appreciate the feedback and criticism. I was wondering though, how long do you wear a dust mask before you change it for a new one?
The only time you'd need the self rescuer is if there was a fire, it would be a shock if it failed...
I also worked in gypsum, potash and tin besides four coal mines during my years underground.
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Post by dazbt on Oct 12, 2012 12:24:48 GMT -5
Thank you for your critique. I am aware that all the pieces of safety equipment are important parts. The idea was to gage which part the worker feels is most important to them. I wasn't suggesting what would be the one thing that you would take if you had to choose. I'm from Canada, but I am trying to learn about mining around the world. My focus is mainly on shoulders up protection, hence the reason for only listing the ones that I did. I do appreciate the feedback and criticism. I was wondering though, how long do you wear a dust mask before you change it for a new one?
The only time you'd need the self rescuer is if there was a fire, it would be a shock if it failed...
I also worked in gypsum, potash and tin besides four coal mines during my years underground.
I guess you are referring to self rescuer as we knew them (i.e. Co convertors) as opposed to the modern SCSR (O2 producing units) ....... even then Co can be produced without there actually being a fire, produced by pyrolysis and the SCSR could be used in atmospheres saturated with other gasses, Carbon Dioxide, Methane etc. ............. that is of course if you are lucky enough to have one that actually works !! |
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Post by shropshirebloke on Oct 12, 2012 16:07:03 GMT -5
My first priorities would be a strong union and decent management - the rest seems to follow. I worked for a couple of years in the late 70s in a Coal Board pit - when we started training we were told that we were working "In the safest pit, in the safest area, of the safest mining industry in the world".
Since then I've realised that we did many things that wouldn't have been allowed elsewhere (the pit was running down to closure), but I still felt a damned sight safer working there than I ever did in my previous couple of jobs working in local factories.
I think the main thing was that the workforce and management were basically on the same side.
The one thing it left me with is a personal health and safety culture (no, not a fanatic but just sensible) that's stayed with me and stood me in good stead for over thirty years. It's still second nature for me to make sure I know the second means of egress when I'm in a strange building.
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Post by John on Oct 12, 2012 16:58:41 GMT -5
I spent more years in private enterprise, one company insisted as part of our employment contract that we were a member of our related trade unions, that was ICI at their Boulby Mine.
British Gypsum wasn't such a strong unionised company, although I changed from the ETU to the General and Municipal Union who gave us better representation.
Both mines were as safe as could be worked in, both companies had strong safety programs.
Although my last colliery I worked out was owned by the NSW government, it was part of a group that was run as a corporation, to make a profit for the NSW taxpayers... Again, they were strong on safety, there was one fatality while I worked there and that was on the surface over the Christmas holiday shutdown, I still can't to this day see how the electrician and his Bro In Law Engineer could have made such a fatal mistake.
BUT, our engineer implemented a colour code for transformer oil that has grown to a world wide standard. The accident occurred because cleaning fluid, about 80% water was in the wrong 55 gallon drum, water and 11Kv just don't mix.
Some of the things we got away with, with the NCB would get you sacked in NSW collieries, although I knew of some who did ride the "magic carpet" woe betide anyone caught doing it!!
The Inspectors were just as bad as UK Mines Inspectors too!! ;D But then again, many were ex UK mine Managers who had took a step up from Managing NSW collieries.
All in all I felt as safe in NSW collieries as I did in NCB collieries.
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Post by John on Oct 12, 2012 17:52:17 GMT -5
When I was at Renison Bell tin mine in Tassie, two things would get you sacked on the spot with no union backing what soever.
One was smoking or eating in the process plant and the other fighting, both fighters would be clearing their lockers out right away.
The reason why they were very strict on those two items was fighting could end up with one or the other mangled in machinery and part of the processing of the tin ore liberated large amounts of arsenic. No1 rule after being in the process plant was to wash hands thoroughly!!
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Post by dazbt on Oct 13, 2012 5:20:05 GMT -5
Shoulders down protection .............
Kneepads, bloody kneepads, what can I say
The first time of wearing you made my day
And every day after that you managed to ruin
I suspect you knew just what you were doing.
Protecting the patella but stopping the blood
Retaining water when dragged through mud.
But finally saved as God’s own gift
With orgasmic removal at the end of the shift.
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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 21, 2012 20:40:46 GMT -5
I have another question... Who supplies the safety equipment? Are you required to purchase it yourself or is it supplied by the mining company?
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Post by John on Oct 22, 2012 6:09:51 GMT -5
I have another question... Who supplies the safety equipment? Are you required to purchase it yourself or is it supplied by the mining company? I can only comment on two countries, UK and Australia, the employer has to supply safety equipment, hard hats, gloves, dust masks, belt, lamp, self rescuer, boots, hearing protection, eye protection, etc.. |
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Post by dazbt on Oct 22, 2012 8:40:42 GMT -5
It always niggled me that we had to pay for our own oral dust suppressant materials though and during the 1973 winter of discontent everybody had to buy their own candles.   |
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Post by John on Oct 22, 2012 8:55:22 GMT -5
It always niggled me that we had to pay for our own oral dust suppressant materials though and during the 1973 winter of discontent everybody had to buy their own candles. ;D |
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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 26, 2012 7:46:26 GMT -5
Would any/all of you mind helping me gather some of this information? Some of the questions you have already helped me answer. I greatly appreciate all your help and feedback.
NEEDS
1. What are the requirements for proper safety in the workplace/site visit?
2. What benefits does the user get while using the current safety equipment?
AESTHETICS
3. Would nice aesthetic properties of the protective gear matter or make you more likely to use it?
4. Would having customizable and stylish equipment make you more likely to purchase the product?
MARKET
5. Will there be a variety of users (size/gender etc.)?
6. What are the different options for protection?
HUMAN FACTORS
7. Do the ergonomics and comfort of the user matter, or is it more about safety?
8. (If safety is more important) Would better fitting equipment lead to better safety?
SAFETY
9. Do you have any concerns about the current safety regulations or protection that exists?
10. Are there ever any issues with workers not wearing the provided protective equipment?
PRODUCT LIFE
11. What happens to the safety equipment after it is finished being used? (end of cycle)
12. Are there certain parts of the equipment that last less time than others?
VOLUME, COST & PRICE
13. What are the costs of each part of current safety equipment?
14. What is the current cost of manufacturing of the product?
DISTRIBUTION
15. How is the gear distributed on site? Does the employer provide it or is the worker responsible for his or her own safety gear?
16. Where is the gear purchased?
MANUFACTURING & MATERIALS
17. What is the volume of current product manufacturing?
18. What is the cost of manufacturing/buying the equipment?
MATERIALS & SUSTAINABILITY
19. What material is currently being used for protective elements i.e. head, ear, respiratory and eye protection?
20. How have the materials or the protective gear changed over the years?
21. What materials would you suggest using for protective elements?
22. Could the materials be recycled after use?
MISCELLANEOUS
23. How do you see mining safety gear evolving in the future, if at all?
24. What products are currently used in industry?
25. How do logistics play a role in manufacturing of new product?
26. Are there any moral or ethical issues that need to be considered with changing mining protection?
27. Should the safety gear be part of a family of products?
28. Are the users happy with the current product?
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Post by John on Oct 26, 2012 8:07:06 GMT -5
My last ten years in the mining industry, (coal) was in NSW, Australia.
The Employer was required by law to furnish cap lamp, self rescuer, hard hat, gloves when needed, hearing protection, dust masks, foul weather equipment for surface workers, safety boots, safety glasses etc.
It was mandatory at all times to wear a hard hat both surface and underground, NSW Coal Mines Regulation Act. In all noisy environments, ie longwall faces, withing the vicinity of a fan, continuous miner, conveyor drive head etc, hearing protection was also mandatory by law.
From what I understand now, safety glasses are required to be worn on faces by law. It was always compulsory to wear safety glasses when around workshop machinery and while using a hammer and chisal, company rules...
Would have been nicer if cap lamp batteries and self rescuers were lighter, 15lbs plus on a belt can be pretty uncomfortable after a few hours!!
Never thought about asthetics with safety equipment... ;D
The only time I had to pay for safety equipment was in the UK during the 1960s, that was for boots and kneepads but that was "cost" price.
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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 31, 2012 14:20:51 GMT -5
How loud is it in the mine? Are the noise levels constant?
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rac
Shotfirer.
Posts: 87
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Post by rac on Oct 31, 2012 14:30:03 GMT -5
How loud is it in the mine? Are the noise levels constant? depends where you are really what machinery is running etc some a lot noisier than others i suppose you could call it constant while ever the machinery was running.if you were away from ay machinery it could be classed as "quiet as the grave" probably with just occasional noises from movement of the strata. |
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Post by John on Oct 31, 2012 15:00:35 GMT -5
At side of a large continuous miner cutting, somewhere around 110 to 120 db of noise...Close to a 50HP aux ventilation fan, in excess of that. A large shearer probably produces around 100db of noise when cutting. Conveyor drive heads around 80 to 90db at a guess.
So now when you chat with us oldies, you'll understand why we say speak up lad!!! ;D
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Post by uqhopkins on Oct 31, 2012 22:26:22 GMT -5
Thanks guys, that's actually very helpful! Are those db numbers from any source or are they an estimation? It's just that for my thesis, I have to have a reference of the statistic.
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Post by John on Nov 1, 2012 5:49:47 GMT -5
Thanks guys, that's actually very helpful! Are those db numbers from any source or are they an estimation? It's just that for my thesis, I have to have a reference of the statistic. |
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Post by erichall on Nov 1, 2012 10:13:19 GMT -5
I doubt it being of use to our Canadian friend, and I realised that vast improvements have been made in later years , but in the 60's-80's, the accepted safety equipment consisted of Hard Hat, knee Pads for thinner seams, steel-capped boots (or even s.c.wellingtons in wet conditions) a cap lamp with lead acid battery worn on belt,and a self-rescuer.
At times we trialled special helmets, with a self-contained clean air system incorporated) for use in rock headings, and were always trying to stress the use of ear-defenders, and dust masks, either disposable or gas-mask type. These were taken up or not by the men concerned, and eventually achieved some success.
As a former Deputy, Overman and Undermanager, and as a Safety Engineer, the one piece of equipment I always reached for automatically was my re-lighter Flame Safety Lamp. Even on visits to other collieries, whilst walking underground, I would be feeling on my belt because 'something was missing' until I realised I wasn't carrying my FSL. My personal feelings for this piece of equipment were that it would not fail (Methane will always burn on the lowered flame of an FSL at a specific height for a fixed percentage. A methanometer can be rendered u/s by simply keeping it switched on in a dense pocket of CH4 such as could be found in many edges of goaf) It would also tell of the absence of sufficient O2, as can be found in areas of relatively high CO2.
A rather tragic example of this occurred early one afternoon. Myself and the Undermanager were talking in his surface officewhen we got the call that a man had been trapped uner a rockfall in a development district. Without second thought, we both tore out of the office, ran down 2x400yard x1 in 4 drifts, along some 800 yards of development gate to the site, where the Deputy was waiting for us. He stood with his oil-lamp in his hand, The Undermanager and I turned to look at each other, then realised that not ony were we wearing cap lamps, batteries and self rescuers, helmets, knee pads and Safety Boots, the automatic reaction for both of us as we left the office was to grab our FSL. Not the best of equipment for running in, and on reflection, unnecessary, since the Deputy AND the Overman were on site, both with FSLs., but done automatically.
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Post by Ragger on Nov 1, 2012 11:42:06 GMT -5
Thanks guys, that's actually very helpful! Are those db numbers from any source or are they an estimation? It's just that for my thesis, I have to have a reference of the statistic. As I recall pit readings in the UK were dBa. The 'a' was, i think, a weighted, which was meant the noise reading equipment was "hearing" the same as a human ear. The machines we used only recorded up to 120 dBa. After the 1990 (I think) European noise legislation, 90dBa was supposed to be the limit allowed before hearing protectors must be used. The 90dBa was the average over a period of time. I forget how many hours it was. Remember, with the decibel system, 3dba above 90dBa was actually double the noise level. 96dBa was double again. Some of the most severe readings came from conveyor belt drive screech, which was sometimes above the 120dBa that the noise meter could read. |
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Post by uqhopkins on Nov 11, 2012 16:51:53 GMT -5
How long does the current headlamp battery last?
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Post by John on Nov 11, 2012 19:30:03 GMT -5
How long does the current headlamp battery last? A caplamp usually will last a double shift, that's the lead acid battery type, the newer LED types with the newer batteries I have no idea. |
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boaz
Trainee
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Post by boaz on Nov 12, 2012 3:33:26 GMT -5
The modern, LED lamps can last up to 20 hours+ on standby when used just as a light. There are also lamps with radios fitted, normally for use in non-intrinsically safe applications such as hard rock/metal mining with a higher powered battery to run both lamp and radio and in some cases miner tracking and collision avoidance. Check out www.jannatec.com there are a couple of good videos on their web site |
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Post by dazbt on Nov 12, 2012 4:54:00 GMT -5
Doesn’t quite answer any of the questions posed, but might be of interest, check out Pic 13 for a good example of mining safety wear in a Chinese ‘private’ mine; lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/30/mining-coal-and-melting-ice/In coal mines of India in or around 1975 the newly formed Coal India limited introduced safety wear, steel toe-capped canvas boots and plastic hard hats, but not every miner wanted to wear these two items, a bit like in the UK in the 1960s when in some NCB mines a few of the old timers refused to wear hard hats and stuck with their flat caps and old canvas peaked hats. At one particular drift mine in India on my first trip underground I was stopped at the drift entrance by an official looking guy who had a deputy’s stick, he blocked my way and with the stick tapped my boots and before I have chance to ask he raised the stick and lightly tapped my helmet and then held is arm out as if giving me permission to enter the mine, three of four steps into the drift there was a board on which hung a row of shiny new helmets and below these was a bench under which were a dozen or more brand new safety boots. I just had to ask, it turns out that many of the colliers hated wearing the hard hats, partly because they had to carry coal baskets on their head and found it easier to wear a coiled ring of cloth on their head to balance the basket, the boots were a slightly different matter. Coal India provided a new free issue pair of these boots to each miner every year and although these boots were popular, not just amongst the underground workers they were considered a valuable bartering asset, pit boots in good condition could be sold or exchanged for ‘best going–out shoes’ at local shoe shops, so, many of the miners saved their new issue boots to sell on. Coal India officials realised this and introduced the ‘check it out’ official at the mine portal, the stick tapping ensured that each miner that entered was wearing steel capped boots and a hard hat, but that was as far as his duties went, once the miners had passed inspection there was nothing to stop them hanging up their hats and exchanging them for turbans, the boots were swapped for rubber flip-flops or believe it or not, nothing at all, working all shift in bare feet ………… sounds incredible but it was true, I hadn’t the courage to write about this until I came across the above photo showing barefooted miners in China, (note also the woven hard hats). |
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Post by uqhopkins on Nov 25, 2012 19:37:06 GMT -5
Could you guys tell me the Regular tasks, procedures & Non-routine tasks, procedures for a days work in the mines?
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Post by John on Nov 26, 2012 8:43:20 GMT -5
Could you guys tell me the Regular tasks, procedures & Non-routine tasks, procedures for a days work in the mines?
As longwall face electrician at the colliery I worked at in Oz, another one of my duties was to train miners on how to operate the roof supports, both the fitter and myself also "mucked in" with the face crew taking turns after our own work was done, in cutting coal, advancing the face supports etc..
But as I had to sign daily for the equipment in my charge, I'd make sure my examinations were complete before helping the mining crew.
My last two UK mining elec jobs were in mines of rock, and generally kept me busy, rebuilding equipment, repairing trailing cables, preparing HV armoured cables, ie making the ends off and installing plugs on them, external exams during production and internal exams during maintenance shifts. |
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Post by uqhopkins on Nov 30, 2012 9:08:18 GMT -5
Thanks for all your help and advice gentlemen. If you would like to see where I'm at with my project, I can send you an email of my final 3 concepts. ![]() [/img] |
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